Check this or value bet river?

[happycamper374]

Game #1632392853: Hold'em FL ($2/$4) - 2006/02/21 - 16:49:04 (ET)
Table "Brunei" Seat 6 is the button.
Seat 1: undone4 ($98.50 in chips)
Seat 2: aul55555 ($80.11 in chips)
Seat 3: Fairy_boy ($45.98 in chips)
Seat 4: MasNisse ($155.50 in chips)
Seat 5: happy374 ($138.75 in chips)
Seat 6: Bimarn ($162.75 in chips)
Seat 7: floppy ($83.25 in chips)
Seat 8: garddan ($161.25 in chips)
Seat 9: 2046 ($180 in chips)
Seat 10: BadBeat66 ($82.25 in chips)
floppy: posts small blind $1
garddan: posts big blind $2
----- HOLE CARDS -----
dealt to happy374 [Kh Th]
2046: calls $2
BadBeat66: calls $2
undone4: folds
aul55555: folds
Fairy_boy: calls $2
MasNisse: folds
happy374: calls $2
Bimarn: folds
floppy: calls $1
garddan: checks
----- FLOP ----- [Tc 5s 9h]
floppy: checks
garddan: checks
2046: bets $2
BadBeat66: folds
Fairy_boy: calls $2
happy374: raises $4
floppy: folds
garddan: folds
2046: raises $4
Fairy_boy: folds
happy374: calls $2
----- TURN ----- [Tc 5s 9h][Kc]
2046: checks
happy374: bets $4
2046: calls $4
----- RIVER ----- [Tc 5s 9h Kc][Qc]
2046: checks
happy374: checks
----- SHOW DOWN -----
2046: shows [Ad Td] (A Pair of Tens, Ace high)
happy374: shows [Kh Th] (Two Pairs, Kings and Tens, Queen high)
happy374 collects $32.50 from Main pot
----- SUMMARY -----
Total pot $34 Main pot $32.50 Rake $1.50
Board [Tc 5s 9h Kc Qc]
Seat 1: undone4 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: aul55555 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: Fairy_boy folded on the Flop
Seat 4: MasNisse folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: happy374 showed [Kh Th] and won ($32.50) with Two Pairs, Kings and Tens, Queen high
Seat 6: Bimarn (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: floppy (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 8: garddan (big blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 9: 2046 showed [Ad Td] and lost
Seat 10: BadBeat66 folded on the Flop
****HAND ENDS****

[happycamper374]

anybody with a jack has me, and the backdoor flush got there too.

[cavman]

i'd value bet if the villain is loose and passive. if villain is tricky or very aggressive, check behind. if villain is tight and passive and check-raises, then fold.

[biggle10]

Value bet. If villain had a J, he would've continued to bet on the turn when he picked up the gutshot + whatever he had on the flop.

[guitarizt]

I would value bet here 90% of the time, but it depends.

[alanpsych]

I'm a horrible river wuss myself, but he's telling you he loved the flop, but just hated the turn. Even though he had the lead, he voluntarily gave it to you. If the turn scared him, then the Q on the river isn't going to make him feel much better. JT is really the only hand I can imagine him having that has you beat. I think you pick up an extra BB with a river bet nearly all the time here.

[iil_m0lly]

don't worry about the backdoor flush. he 3bet the flop. and the 10 is the club.
i also don't think he 3bet's with 10J, so the backdoor straight is less likely.
i value bet it.

[scotty1139]

Good post, happy, but next time omit the results for a bit... I think you're going to get better reponses.

[barrin6]

I wouldn't value bet here. I been check raised so many times on the river.

[cavman]

I wouldn't value bet here. I been check raised so many times on the river.

that's not a reason not to value bet, if you can fold to the check-raise knowing you are beat. you should value bet if there is over a 50% chance that you will win if you get called.